Base station firmware update kills the base station dead. All was fine until doing recommended upd

[Synthesis]

 

 

This is a well known issue. The firmware update does not "brick" anything. It instead, increases the sensitivity to the onboard error detection routines. The device was already failing and the firmware update caught it. You just got them, so you're probably within the 14 day return period. I'm going to send you some information about who to contact to get your devices replaced.

Check your PMs.

Thank you,

-John C

[iansfletcher]

So your telling me the device was 'failing' after two hours and the update sort of 'finished em off'. Well really it doesnt matter to me what the cause is, does it. The upshot is. Worked, firmware update' doesnt work. Telling me they arent 'bricked' doesnt help. From my point of view they may as well be. Whats the difference, non functional is non functional and as these things arent cheap i would welcome the solution and look forward to whatever you can do?

 

[Synthesis]

 

 

The actual issue is the laser rotors are not spinning at the speed they are supposed to for accurate tracking. It's possible they were damaged in shipping. Either way, the only method to fix them is to physically repair them. It's important to know the reason for the cause of the issue and not blame it on the firmware. Firmware updates are important and spreading misinformation about the cause of the problem could confuse other users.

I've sent you further instructions via PM.

Thank you,

-John C

[bkwoodruff]

John/HTC Vive Customer Support,

 

Understood that the firmware update is intended to identify devices already operating outside of tolerances.  How then, does HTC explain brand new devices that the firmware update determines are outside of tolerance?  Are these devices being tested in the factory?  If so, are they being tested with the latest firmware updates to ensure they will operate within tolerance?  Are you suggesting that shipping is damaging the base stations between the factory and the customer?  Are these devices that fragile?

 

What it looks like to your customer base, is that HTC (Vive) is manipulating the customer to process a product hardware recall.  We buy the product, HTC (Vive) has not tested it under current firmware, customer's BRAND NEW devices fail when firmware is updated, customer is burdended with RMA return and waiting for HTC (Vive) to REPAIR the devices.  I think that's why HTC has refused to replace the bases with NEW bases...because ALL of that generation of base stations need to be recalled/repaired.  But it appears that, rather than proactively repair them as an internal QC measure, HTC has chosen to sell them to the customer and then make the customer return them for RMA repairs.  O.o  This business practice is frankly shocking!  I honestly think you are headed for a Class Action Lawsuit.  Truly baffling.

[bkwoodruff]

 

 

Thank you for restoring my post.  I know it sounds "snarky" but i sincerely would like some professional dialogue about this.  Appreciate your help and repsonses.

[Synthesis]

 

 

There's a lot to unpack here and I've addressed much of it in previous threads, but I'll try to provide a complete answer to your questions.
1. When base stations are manufactured, they are calibrated and tested in the factory. This is a necessary part of the production process.
2. HTC does not write or release the firmware for the base stations. Valve does, through SteamVR.
3. Not every base station you buy left the factory floor last week. Especially if you're buying from third party retailers, they often have stock on hands for months and months before they finally sell it off.
4. It is possible for devices to be damaged in shipping. We do our best to avoid this, but it can still happen. If so, you can usually return it for a replacement immediately.
5. All electronics and/or mechanisms with moving parts should be handled carefully.

As far as your speculation goes, I can assure you that is not the case. I understand that it can be frustrating to have to RMA a device you've only had for a few months, however, that does not reflect the consumer base's experience as a whole. There is a reason manufacturers offer limited warranties for their products: to cover such instances. If it were normal for nothing to ever go wrong on it's own in consumer electronics, no one would bother with warranties.

As far as replacing devices with 'new' ones, that really isn't something that hardware companies do as standard. In some cases, there might be some sort of extended or special warranty for an additional fee, but in general, your standard limited warranty doesn't cover replacement in place of repair. We actually do have an extended warranty offering for select products under the Advantage and Advantage Plus program for commercial users. https://enterprise.vive.com/us/ If you're interested in learning more.

In short, our warranty and RMA policies are in line with industry standards for consumer electronics and VR hardware as well. Again, I do understand that you're frustrated. If you've already RMA'd your device, I can check on the status or if you haven't set up the repair yet, I can help you get that taken care of.

What would you like me to do?
Thank you,
-John C

[bkwoodruff]

John,

 

Thank you for the detailed response.  I am already underway with the RMA process on my faulty base station.  The issues/concerns I bring up appear to be more widespread than you suggest based on my research online, but i do recognize that online posts tend to draw the "vocal minority".  I appreciate your help but am now in contact with customer support services via direct email coorespondence  and do not need any further assistance at this time.

[TilS]

"The device was already failing and the firmware update caught it"

-> the very same thing happened to two of our base stations in the past 48 hours. 

One of them was in use for less than 100 hours total, the other one for less than 12 hours, both blinking red within 48 hours. 

Also, we noticed this: 

 

One of the 2.0 base stations has the proper (2.0) icon, the other one... doesn't, since it's shown as a 1.0 lighthouse. 

I simply can't believe that new hardware will work flawlessly at first and then die a sudden death, especially not with the icon issue attached to it. 

Any input on this would be most welcome!

Thanks,

Til

[Synthesis]

 

 

I responded to your other post and I've already addressed this particular base station issue earlier in the thread, but I'll summarize it.

The requirements for sub milimeter tracking are very exact. If one of the rotors falls below the threshold, the system will display an error now that the tracking accuracy has dropped. The only solution to this is to repair the device. It does not matter how long the device was in operation or how new it is. Occasionally, they show up DOA. Other users have the same base stations they pre-ordered back in 2016 with no failure. Precise mechanisms can fail without warning and they need to be repaired.

The only advice I can offer is be gentle with your base stations. Don't place them somewhere they might get struck or bumped during play and always make sure you turn them off before moving them.

Thank you,

-John C

[TilS]

Hi John,

again, thanks for clearing up the issue - I should probably have only posted it once in hindsight. 

We must have been very unlucky with our rate of failure, however, I can assure you that both Lighthouses were treated as gently as humanly possible; one of them was moved less than 10 meters out of the original, sealed VIVE Pro packaging.

If DOAs happen, and the mechanisms are this fragile and delicate, it would seem wise for HTC to stock their vendors (at least in other markets!) with a decent supply of solo-lighthouses - not even being able to buy a replacement even if you wanted to, but instead having to un-mount, re-package and return two complete sets is rather frustrating. 

Oh and - something you might like to know.

The official HTC Support Ticket I received gave me the (machine translated) instructions from a Steampowered discussion on how to install the "calibration rescue" firmware on the 2.0 base stations. 

However, since there are no A, B, C channels on the base station if I am correct, but A, B and C channels are mentioned in those instructions, it would seem that they recommend using the 1.0 firmware - which seems a little bit risky in my opinion because that firmware must be completely different from the 2.0 firmware.

Anyway, I have to get up in 4 hours to make a 2 hour drive and see if I can fix the unrelated issue with two more VIVE Pros for our client in the morning - have a good day and thanks for your input.

Cheers,

Til